I'm kinda ok with MCO -> CRO Swap; a indepth personal view
EDIT: this post https://www.reddit.com/Crypto_com/comments/i2yhuz/open_letter_to_kris_from_one_of_cdcs_biggest/ from u/CryptoMines expresses my sentiments and concerns better than I could ever put into words myself. I'd say read his/her post instead. Very long post ahead, but TL;DR, I actually see this swap as a positive change, despite fearing for what it may do to my portofolio, and having mixed feelings about its consequences on CDC reputation.Before I start, for the sake of context and bias, here's my personal situation as a CDC user:
I'm just a average Joe, with a 500 MCO Jade card. I bough 50 MCO at 5,22€ in September 2019 and staked for Ruby, then bough 440 MCO at 2.47€ in March 2020 and upgraded to Jade. The total amount of MCO I own is currently 515, and everything above the 500 stake is cashback rewards.
I bought MCO exclusively for the card and bonus Earn interest benefits, and had no plans to unstake my MCO. Now with the swap, definetly won't unstake.
The MCO -> CRO conversion rates increased the fiat value of my MCO in about 1000€.
I own a decent amount of CRO, wich I bought at ~0,031€ in March 2020.
The country where I live is crypto friendly and completely crypto-tax free; I only have to pay income tax if I deposit a certain threshold of fiat in my bank.
Take all these factors into account as possible (if not major) influencers or bias on my opinions; both the emotional and economical ones. Call me a fool or a devil's advocate if you want, but keep your torches and pitchforks down. As we say here on Reddit: "Remember the human".----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Like all of you, I woke up to find this anouncement, wich came right the #[email protected] out of nowere, and gives you little to no options. Good or bad, this announcement arrived as basicly a "comply or die" choice. Emotionally, this came as both terrifying and disgusting; but rationally, I cannot blame CDC for it. Because wether we like it or not, CDC is a centralized company, and the MCO tokens were never a stock or legally binding contract; something wich pretty much every crypto company or ICO warns in their T&C and risk warnings. Not to mention the mostly unregulated status of the cryptocurrency and. I'll call this "dishonest" any day, but I cannot see it as a "scammy" since I can't see how they broke any rules or terms. A scammer would take your money/assets away, but CDC is offering you to swap it for another asset wich you can sell right away if you want. And at current price, it is still worth more or less as much fiat as MCO cost at the 5 $/€ wich was more or less the comunity standard used for calculating the card prices. And by that, I mean that the fiat value of 50/500/5000 MCO (as CRO) is actually not far from the 250/2500/25'000 $/€ that the comunity commonly used as standard when calculating the ROI and (under)valuation of MCO. So CDC is at least trying to give us the option to get (some) our money back, and not at a unfair rate. If you happened to buy MCO at a price higher than this, I can't see how that's CDC's fault, just as I don't see anyone blaming Bitcoin or Altcoins for getting them stuck at the top of the 2017 bubble burst. I read many posts in this reddit calling this a "backstab" and "betrayal" of early investors and for the people who "believed in MCO". Emotionally, I share your sentiment.But after thinking it for a while, I'd say this was actually very rewarding for early investors and long term MCO supporters. As CDC clearly sates in the swap rules; nobody is going to lose their card tier or MCO stake benefits (at least not yet), and your stake DOES NOT unstake automatically after 180 days. Actually, so far they never did unstake automatically, you had to manually unstake yourself. With this in mind, everyone who already got their cards, or at least staked MCO to reserve one, basicly got them 3-5 times cheaper than future users; and IMHO, now the $/€ price of cards feels more fair and sustainable compared to their benefits.So in a sense, everyone who supported and believed on the MCO for its utility (i.e. the card and app benefits) has been greatly rewarded with perks that they get to keep, but are now out of reach for a lot of people.Likewise, the people who believed and invested in CRO (for whatever reason), have also been rewarded, as their CRO tokens now have more utility. So either the price of CRO crashes down to around 0.05 $/€, or the people who bought MCO/CRO early or cheap are now massively benefited. But then again, so is everyone who bought or mined Bitcoin in its early days, or invested in Bitcoin at crucial points of its history... how is that unfair? Some people bought Ethereum at 1'400 $ on a mix of hopes/promises that it would continue to rise; it didn't. And even today with DeFi and ETH 2.0 ever closer, it is still far from that price. And I know what some of you are thinking: "The cards aren't avaiable in my country yet, that's why I didn't buy/stake."Well, they weren't avaiable in my country either when I staked 50 MCO. Heck, the cards weren't avaiable in anyones country when MCO started, but many people still bought it and staked it. That's exacly what "early adopter", "long supporter" and "believing in MCO" means. On the other hand, the people who invested on MCO as a speculative asset and decided to HODL and hoard MCO, hoping for its price to moon and then sell MCO at big profit, had their dreams mercilessly crushed by this swap... and good lord, I feel their pain.But this is also where I'll commit the sin of being judgemental, because IMHO, speculating on MCO never made any sense to me; MCO was a utility token, not a value token, so it should not (and could not) ever be worth more than the value of its utility. That's basicly how stablecoins and PAXG are able to stay stable; because nobody will pay more/less than the value of the asset/service they represent. Tough now that I'm looking at the new card stake tiers in CRO, I have to give credit to the MCO hodlers I just now criticised; maybe you were right all along. Unless the price of CRO crashes or corrects, I wich case, I un-rest my case. One thing I'll agree with everyone tough, is that I fell that CDC just suckerpunched it's comunity. Because even if we have no vote on its decisions (wich again, we aren't necessarily entitled to, since they are a privante and centralized business) they should/could have warned that this was in their plans well in advance; if anything to allow those who wouldn't like it to exit this train calmly. Also the CRO stake duration reset. The mandatory reset of your CRO stake for taking advantage of the early swap bonus feels like another gut-punch. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Now that we got emotional feelings out of the way, here's my sentiment about how this will affect the overall CDC ecossystem. One common criticism of the sustainability of MCO was that its supply cap could never allow a large number of cards to be issued, and how could CDC keep paying the cashbacks and rebates. On the oposite corner, one of the major criticisms of the sustainability of CRO, was it's ridiculously huge supply cap and inflation caused by the gradual un-freezing and release of more CRO into the system. But now that MCO and CRO became one, it might just have made both issues more sustainable. Now the huge supply cap of CRO makes more sense, as it allows a much larger number of future users to stake for cards (at higher costs, but still). And because most card cashback is small parcels, this large supply also ensures that CDC can keep paying said cashbacks for a long time; especially since it can be semi-renewable trough the trading fees we pay in CRO. Before this, the MCO you got as cashback had no use, other than selling it for fiat or speculate on its price. But CRO can be used, at the very least, to receive a discount on trading fees. And everytime you pay trading fees in CRO or spend CRO on a Syndicate event, some of that CRO goes back to CDC, wich they can use to keep paying the cahsback/rebates. And keep in mind, the technicalities of CRO can be changed, as well as the perks and utilities it can be used for. So even if this current model doesn't fix everything (wich it probably doesn't) it can still be changed to patch problems or expand its use. Another obvious potentially positive outcome of this, is that now CDC only has to focus on 1 token, so it makes it easier to manage and drive its value. People complained that CDC was neglecting MCO over promoting CRO, but now they can focus on both services (cards/exchange) at the same time. Sure, this might not bring much advantage to the common customer, but its probably a major resource saver and optimizer at corporate levels; wich in the long term ultimately benefits its customers. Much like Ethereum is undergoing major changes to ensure its scalability, the crypto companies themselves also have to change to acommodate the growing number of users, especially as the cryptomarket and DeFi are growing and becoming more competitive. Business strategies that were once successfull became obsolete, and exchanges that once held near-monopolies had to adjust to rising competitors. There is no reason why CDC shouldn't keep up with this, or at least try to. Point is, the financial markets, crypto or otherwise, are not a status quo haven. And when something is wrong, something has to be changed, even if it costs. The very rise of cryptocurrencies and blockchain, wich is why we are here in the first place, is a perfect example of this, as it experiments and provides alternatives to legacy/traditional products and technologies. Was this the best solution to its current problems? Is this what will protect us as customers from a potentially unsustainable business model? I have no idea. This change ripped me too from my previous more or less relaxed status quo (the safety of the value of the CRO I bough for cheap), along with CRO late investors wich now probably fear for the devaluation of their CRO. To say nothing of the blow this represents for my trust (and I believe everyone elses trust) on CDC and its public relations. It's not what CDC did, it's how they did it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wether you actually bothered to read all I wrote or just skip everything (can't blame you), I'm eager to hear your opinions and whatever criticisms on my opinions you may have. If you just want to vent at me, you are welcome too; now you can raise your pitchforks and torches.
Ok, A little backround. I know hardware and networking. I can build just about any config of a computer. I understand overclocking and undervolting. I can invest around 2,700 for initial investment. So do I buy hardware to build a GPU miner with at least 6 cards or more? Probably RX580 as they are cheap and I have one in my rig. More on that later. Or do I a Asic miner like this I understand a GPU miner is multiple coins and not Bitcoin, and Asic is nothing but Bitcoin. I've done the math on the Asic miner and the ROI in about 3 months with a net gain of about ~10,000 USD a year @ .13 cents per Watt. I've had a hard time finding a solid or semi way of calculating the earnings for a GPU miner. Not only because it is many coins or dedicated to one coin, but there our other variables involved. However I have more control of the hardware if it fails. I dipped my toe into mining with my own rig that has a RX580 fatboy and a AMD Phenom ii x4 955 black edition. I overclocked the GPU and undervolted the CPU to reduce heat since it was hitting 62 cel. The GPU gets 12.5 sol/s and the CPU was getting ~322 h/s. All this added up to ~170 watts and a net of .00218322 BTC/Month. This was all done using Cudo as it was easy to find and setup just to test. This was just a test to see how it would work. I wouldn't use Cudo to full scale as it is a pool and the transfer to a Wallet is pretty steep in relationship to earns. I understand that in a pool you get your share based upon how much of the "work" you did to get find block. So do I build or buy? With that much computation power do I need to join a pool? What software is best for pool or alone? I am comfortable with CLI as long as it's well documented, but would like a remote GUI. Also what is the best wallet with the best fees for transactions. Currently using uphold since I use Brave. I think I covered as much as I could, if you have any questions let me know. Any advice would be great. If I should post this else where let me know please or I could just cross post it. TIA. Be safe, stay safe! Edit: Words and BTC earning was WAY off then I first typed this.
Is worth start mining with the actual situation of the cryptocurrency market?
I've been watching the market for over 3 years now. For those years I've been a student with no money to invest, and now that I'm almost out of the university and I have some money I wanna finally start on this world. For some weeks now I've been working on a planning for building a 6 GPU mining rig, all theoretical earnings calculated with NiceHash & WhatToMine. The actual theoretical profits for this one are like 250 EU month (1.40€/day per GPU) with AMD RX 5700 , having an electricity cost of o.o79EUkWH. I've compared all the actual GPUs on the market, and that's the best one I could find in terms of ROI (I start to get profits after 1 year and 1 month). I've seen some posts talking about much better profits & less ROIs but I couldn't find a better profit for a GPU rig, maybe I'm doing something wrong! To see if the theoretical numbers are right I tested them with an RTX 2060 on my own personal computer and I had a profit of 1.20 EUR /day when the theoretical profit for that GPU was about 0.80 EUR /day. So, after all those weeks comparing, thinking about a long term Investment plan and searching for LOTS of information i conclude that it's worth spending a total of 3000 EUR into mining. Now I wanna ask you guys, with the actual situation of bitcoin (going up and up) and the difficulty raising over time...is it worth investing all that money on GPU mining right now? I'm afraid about investing the money and start to see a massive decrease in my profits, either for bitcoin going down or the difficulty going up nonstop. Also, I've not exposed all my plan, but doing it this way (mining with NiceHash and with 6 AMD RX 5700) is a nice plan or there is something with better profitability/ ROI? Maybe mining myself small cryptos and then exchange them to bitcoin, etc... All knowledge is welcomed. Btw, I'm a computer science engineer, that's why I wanna start on mining instead of trading stocks, because I know how computers work and I think that my knowledge on Pc & GPUs could help me on doing this efficiently. And sorry for my "not so good English", it's my 3rd language! Thanks all. EDIT: I could also buy the GPUs & equipment for the rig on a 2nd hand market, which would totally lower the total price of the rig, reaching ROI faster and if something goes not as expected, have less losses. Ofc buying at a 2nd hand is somehow risky but maybe worthy!
This sub is a mess and needs to get out of the anger stage: How to move forward from the crash if you're a bagholder
Back in December 2017 I did a valuation attempt of Bitcoin on this sub and got around 5K with some grossly optimistic assumptions. Its taken a long time but finally gone down below that. You've probably heard many people tell you it would eventually happen back in December 2017 and to reduce expose to crypto (including me), but when you're hyped up on 20% gains every week its hard to be cautious or engage in defensive measures. To many the last quarter of 2017 and into early 2018 was like a beach party with coke and Victoria Secret models. Who wants to listen to someone tell you about how you're gonna crash hard with a headache the next morning? With this latest crash, Bitcoin's price is back to roughly mid October 2017, which is roughly when the mainstream mania started. Many on this sub entered after October 2017 and hence are now left holding heavy bags. Many are down 80% or even 90%. Here is the current losses from ATH for the top cryptos:
Loss from ATH
Who do we blame?
At a time like this its easy to get angry, to look at someone to blame. Whether Roger Ver and the hash wars, whether BAAKT delay, whether whales or SEC or institutions, everyone has their favorite boogeyman. No one thing is the reason why the market is down 80%. The reality is that Bitcoin (and all other crypto by extension) was ovevalued even by grossly overoptimistic measures. Its not BAKKT or the whales trying to get your coins for cheap. The same people who were buying at near peak bubble thinking they were getting into the chance of a lifetime are prone to look for someone to blame for their losses, when it was actually their fault for buying near the end of a mania. Nobody wants to admit that it was their own greed, lack of research and irrational behavior that lead to the gross overvaluation of all cryptocurrency.
Is it over yet?
The $6K consolidation was likely a result of the market coiling tighter and tighter around the mining breakeven point for some of the smaller miners. The big firms in China are profitable mining below 6K, but many smaller ones in the US and Europe aren't. You can actually see the total hash rate going down. Once it broke it was a big fall straight down. Bitcoin is mined at 12.5 BTC. per block at 10 minute blocks, which comes out to around 1800 BTC every day. This 1800 BTC has to be absorbed by every day, which means the following at different price levels:
Daily net buying needed to absorb mined coins
At the current price, at least theoretically $8.4 million in demand is needed to cover the mining output. Of course the miners don't immediately dump it all, but it shows why miners have an incentive to keep the price high and try to incite FOMO with a BGD. I can also see that after this latest drop, the "buy the dip" sentiment had substantially gone down, at least compared to the other fast drops in price. This is especially discouraging those who were waiting for the "November bull run", which never came. Its clear to more people now that this probably isn't just downward correction that will reverse, but a multiyear bear market. This is why the bounce has been so weak compared to earlier in the year. Compare that to the last two big 2 day drops:
March 29 - April 1st (drop from 8K to 6K): Within 2 days it bounced back up to 7.5K
June 22-24 (drop from 6.8K to 5.8K): Within 2 days it bounced back to 6.3K
The weakness of this current bounce says it all, people are no longer optimistic that BAKKT or ETF or any other catalyst will lead to a bull run that they can cash out quick. It may be a period of stagnation followed by further drops as big holders take profits. I also think that the FED tightening with rate hikes is leading to a lot more volatility not only in stocks, but crypto as well. Right now asset deflation seems to be a global macro risk as cheap credit dries up, and Bitcoin surely isn't immune from this. My personal view is that at this point we may see further declines, but calling what's going to happen next is always dangerous. A whale (especially a big mining operation) with a series of large orders to clear out the order book on Bitfinex could give us a BGD out of nowhere at any time and take us back to 6K, it would be interesting to see how the market reacts to something like that. But I'm not betting on it leading to any sustained rally past 10K. Quite the opposite. So what's a crypto shrimp to do? I'll split my thoughts into two, for those who are still in the green and those in the loss.
If you're still in the green
If you're still in profit, this is a great time to consider how much more downward selling you can take and also how you can hedge downward risk. If you're someone who purchased when Bitcoin was below $1000, you should calculate your compounded annual ROI and decide if that return is good enough for you. For equities, the long term average is about 10% per year, 20-30% in a good bull market. Its your decision, but taking out profits that exceed principal and reinvesting the principal is not at all a bad idea. For those who invested before Bitcoin reached $1K (April 2017) the current price is still an insane return that no other asset class can match. Another important thing is to think about how you can hedge the risk of downward movement. This is where derivative exchanges are very useful, although you do need to do some research on how derivatives work and how to not get liquidated. If you have substantial holdings, the effort to learn this is worth it. The basic idea is that you can buy short contracts that increase in value as Bitcoin goes down, proportional to the amount of leverage you put to finance the contract. If managed correctly, you can protect your entire stack with a portion as leverage. Its something commonly done by miners, who short Bitcoin with derivatives to hedge their holdings.
If you're in the loss
The untold reality is that HODL is a meme told to newbies to prevent panic selling during a downturn while the smart money cashes out in a more orderly fashion. But does that mean you shouldn't hold if you're already down massively? Well that depends on your own life situation, how much you've invested, and if you don't need the money for the next few years. Mathematically, whether it drops to 4.5K or 3K from the reference of 6K is highly meaningful, its a drop of 25% or 50%. But if your reference starting point is much higher, then it really doesn't matter all that much. A drop from 17K to 4.5K is a 74% loss while down to 3K it would be 82%, massive losses either way. In that sense if this is money you don't need, it makes sense to simply have it stored in a wallet and forget about it for a few years. Who cares if it drops further after a certain point if you don't plan to take it out for a while? Its like in equities markets where people with massive losses don't sell, but instead move the loss position into their retirement fund where they don't plan to take it out for a long time and thus are giving it time to rebound back. But what if its money you need? What if like many out there you took out loans hoping to catch a run to 50K? If you have high interest debt (credit cards...etc), focus on paying that down first. Credit cards generally have high interest and many compound daily, so pay down the debt first rather than trying to pay your debts off with a crypto bull run that may take years to materialize. This is also a good learning opportunity. It is worrying how few people who hold crypto have a clue what any of this even is or how it works. I've always recommended this video to explain how Bitcoin (and other cryptocurrencies) actually work. A good thing to do during catastrophic losses is to honestly access why you got suckered into buying high in the first place. Most people here are young, and this is a valuable lesson in why you shouldn't follow the herd. Everyone is a genius in a bull market, everyone is chasing the next hype. Crypto tends to attract people looking for a get-rich-quick-without-effort crowd, but it takes some mental effort to understand this beyond the buzzwords. Take the time to understand the fundamental reasons why an asset has value and what factors would drive its rise once the hype dies down. What makes Bitcoin valuable, what makes some of the other cryptoassets valuable? If those fundamentals in some way changes, so should your opinion. Its also a great opportunity to help in its adoption by using it. The irony of it all is that people demand that they get rich because of the hard work of buying a bunch of crypto in an exchange and transferring it to their wallet, without any understanding what they're buying into. Also don't be angry. Don't look to blame. Look to learn and improve next time you invest.
Got this weird DM on reddit idk what this guy is up to have any of you ever heard of this https://tradeoptiongains.com Site? u/mikerobin25 Mikerobin2501:52 AM Hello there IDEKMyUsername09:34 AM Howdy Mikerobin2509:47 AM How's it going? IDEKMyUsername12:13 PM Not bad. What's up Mikerobin2512:36 PM I'm doing quite alright, How about you? IDEKMyUsername12:53 PM Not bad Mikerobin2501:39 PM Well, I don't mean to intrude but are you familiar with the term "cryptocurrency", Bitcoin to be precise? IDEKMyUsername03:10 PM Yes Aye Mikerobin2503:25 PM Well, I'm at the moment engaging in an outreach aimed at expanding the clientele of my platform and enlightening the populace on the monetary potential of bitcoin trading and mining. Would you be interested in this? IDEKMyUsername03:26 PM Uh yeah sure I can look into it. What does it include? Mikerobin2503:28 PM Are you familiar with the term "Bitcoin trading"? IDEKMyUsername03:29 PM Yeah somewhat Like selling and buying it? Mikerobin2503:33 PM Well, Bitcoin trading is the process of making profits by buying Bitcoin at a low cost and selling it when the price goes up, This method is referred to as Dollar Cost Averaging(DCA). The Bitcoin trade is volatile, and price move by a significant margin. This activity is done on trading platforms. Are you following? IDEKMyUsername04:07 PM Yep gotcha so far Sorry had to pickup a call Mikerobin2506:51 PM No problem mate. Every platform has an investment procedure and ROI method. Unlike other platforms that engage in day trading (profiting from the volatility of bitcoin which is inefficient), My platform is registered with S9 ant miners that mine the bitcoin you invest to increase exponentially and that’s how you earn profits. Have you heard of the term "Bitcoin mining"? IDEKMyUsername06:52 PM Yes I have Mikerobin2506:57 PM Good. For clarification, Bitcoin mining primarily involves generating and earning off the confirmation of blocks of transaction on the network such as the Blockchain network. This is made possible with the use of special and sophisticated devices called the Bit main devices, Such as the AntMiner S9 and ASIC hardware. These devices are extremely expensive to maintain and require a lot of electricity generation and technical expertise which makes it rarely an option for private individuals who are interested in going into Bitcoin mining. But my platform has been able to provide for this disability. Are you following? IDEKMyUsername06:57 PM I feel ya Yes Mikerobin2507:01 PM Moving on, My platform operates a full S9 Antminer farm. The Antminer s9 has a hash rate of 12.93TH/s which is -+ 7%, Which could generate a ROI of 0.5 BTC within an investment period depending on the investment capital. Note: ROI stands for return of investment while hash rates a measure of how many times the network can attempt to complete this puzzle every second. This means that hash rate is a good indicator of the Bitcoin network's health. Do i still have your attention? IDEKMyUsername07:02 PM Yes Mikerobin2507:05 PM Finally, All investments are made and monitored by the client (you) on the platform's website as you earn profits daily and you can contact me a "Broker" on the platform whenever you need assistance or more information. https://tradeoptiongains.com IDEKMyUsername07:05 PM Hm U have a history of wise investments? I mean don't really know you so not like your a "professional" of any means Mikerobin2507:06 PM Certainly We've been running for a span of 4 years now with optimum services provided IDEKMyUsername07:38 PM oh wow gimmie some more deets? how much money would I expect if i put a quick g bar in? IDEKMyUsername07:53 PM hm? Mikerobin2507:54 PM An investment of $1000 amounts up to the standard ROI stated above which is 50% of 1 bitcoin. Apologies for the late reply, Was attending to a client of mine. IDEKMyUsername07:55 PM so invest of about $1000 would give ruffly 5? nah ur good fam like how I go about that tho u know cause isn't bitcoin like kind of high right now? Mikerobin2507:57 PM Yeah though it would have been more profitable if you had started earlier when it was cheaper but you should be expecting more returns due to the halving coming up. https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/ IDEKMyUsername07:58 PM how high you think its going to get? Mikerobin2507:59 PM Its a highly speculative asset but from my experience and following it's previous halving events, Probably 15-18k. IDEKMyUsername08:01 PM oh jeez thats like as big as the big boom right? how you know its gonna do that? and what if it doesn't lol? do I just l;ose it all Mikerobin2508:05 PM Exactly. If it doesn't, It would remain at its breaking point of 9k or peak point of 10k but i highly doubt it doesn't pump(rise) based on past halving events. You can simply get started by creating your personal account on the platform by which you can start by purchasing bitcoin and you can do this by clicking on the "Register" icon to get started. IDEKMyUsername08:05 PM hmmm idk Kinda need some more security u know what I mean? Mikerobin2508:08 PM I understand. Loses are only made when you sell off, You money remains intact whether it rises or falls as long as you don't sell but your ROI is fully attained on your account on the platform. IDEKMyUsername08:09 PM o Mikerobin2508:10 PM Indeed Mikerobin2508:20 PM Any more questions? IDEKMyUsername08:20 PM uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh no Mikerobin2508:22 PM Okay then, I'm available here if you're interested and need my assistance Enjoy the rest of your day. IDEKMyUsername08:25 PM o ok Yesterday Mikerobin2501:48 PM https://www.fxstreet.com/cryptocurrencies/news/breaking-bitcoin-price-takes-down-9-000-as-10-000-beckons-202004300334 https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/bitcoin-price-gold-oil-2020-best-performing-assets-a9492641.html IDEKMyUsername01:51 PM O I bought it Mikerobin2501:51 PM Pardon? IDEKMyUsername01:52 PM I bought one Mikerobin2501:52 PM On what platform? IDEKMyUsername01:54 PM I'm idk the one u sent me Um* Mikerobin2501:55 PM Really? When did you do this and why wasn't i informed? Today IDEKMyUsername10:19 AM Oh like last last night I thought it was expected U sent me the link and everything ;( Mikerobin2510:22 AM You would have informed me so i can enlighten you more on the procedure. Are you aware that it's a mining platform and you earn profits as an investor? IDEKMyUsername10:23 AM Yah so what would profit be ya reckon? For let's say $1000 over liek a year Mikerobin2510:24 AM What name did you use in registering the account? IDEKMyUsername10:24 AM Uh I'd have to look it up But how much profit did u say it would be about? Mikerobin2510:27 AM 0.5 BTC a month depending on your investment capital that is, I would need the name of your account to register it under my personal database so i can provide you with information and assistance when needed. IDEKMyUsername10:28 AM O damn that's some big bucks right there .5 btc like what 4g? 4 times 11 that's $44,000 a month Mikerobin2510:30 AM How much did you invest and what is the name of your account? Your profit is calculated in respect of your investment capital IDEKMyUsername10:31 AM Like 11grand Mikerobin2510:31 AM And the name? IDEKMyUsername10:31 AM Mmmm How do I find it? Is there a way on the site Mikerobin2510:31 AM What name did you use in creating the account? Didn't you register? IDEKMyUsername10:32 AM Oh like my irl name I thought u meant like a username Mikerobin2510:32 AM Username is what i mean IDEKMyUsername10:33 AM It's gonna be under Jeffery Henderson Jeffery L. Henderson Mikerobin2510:35 AM Okay, Give me a second to record it and ascertain your expected profit. IDEKMyUsername10:35 AM Sick Did u find my account? Mikerobin2510:41 AM I can't find your records on the platform, Maybe a technical difficulty. Could you please sign in and send me a screenshot of your funds deposited through discord please? IDEKMyUsername10:41 AM So tell me mike Where's the cash? Mikerobin2510:41 AM Pardon? IDEKMyUsername10:41 AM You lost it, oh you misplaced it. Now mike you know I don't like to be lied to right? Mikerobin2510:43 AM Since i can't find your account on the platform, I guess that's the ending of our conversation. Good day. IDEKMyUsername10:43 AM So why THE FUCK ARE YOU LIEING TO ME Mikerobin2510:44 AM Prove that you have an account on the platform by sending a screenshot IDEKMyUsername10:44 AM I cannot I did it on Computer Mikerobin2510:45 AM The sign in through your phone, Do i seem like a fool to you? I have a lot of clients to attend to and i don't have time for games IDEKMyUsername10:45 AM I ain't the I one that took another man's money and now can't find it You don't have other clients Let's not play games here How do I get my money out of this depreciating asset? You better help me get my money out of this or were going to have a major issue Mike... IDEKMyUsername11:16 AM U serious rn bro? Ur gonna scam me out of my 💰 ? A day will come when you think yourself safe and happy,. But suddenly your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. and you'll know the debt is paid IDEKMyUsername08:01 PM Br You still my 11 grand Stole What's your name Tell me Or I'll find you
Many people may feel quite confused about their low profit now. Maybe you forget to think about the small details when you are mining. Small little details will make big difference in your final income. Now, i want to share you the 8 skills to improve your benefits. 1, Get a cheaper power Everyone knows the power is the most charge in mining, if we can find a cheaper electricity, it will be good. So, how to get a cheaper electricity? 55% of the mining is in China, and 40% of the mining is in Sichuan China. Why? Because there are many hydroelectric power station in there. So, you can find a place near the station and get a cheaper electricity from them. If you can find free electricity, it is the best anyway 2, Choose low w/t machine As you know, low comsuption machine is very popular those days, like S17 pro 53t, T17 42t. They are 7nm technical, the w/t is low and it can even overclock, it maybe a good choice. Also, we need to consider the price of machine. Cheap price machine means fast ROI, But low W/T machine has a bright future. 3, Buy miner when BTC begin to raise after long drop When BTC price keep falling, of course the machine will be cheaper and cheaper. When the BTC price begin to raise, we can buy miner at that time, because the price is the cheapset and you can earn money back soon. Normally at that time, the good machine will be sold out quickly, when the market feedback that those machine are good, you may be late to get the chance. So, make your plan for purchasing before, when price down, get them. 4, Do not forget BCH, BSV, ZEN coin Do remember SHA-256 Algorithm can mining BCH and BSV as well. Sometimes those coin may get even a better profits than BTC. Some miner has auto setting for BTC, but you can choose BSV and BCH mining if you set it, 5, Notice the half reward period information Because the half reward time is coming in 2020, there will be a chance or a risk for it. Many low hashrate machine may be out of the style and high hashrate will be more competitive. Low your risk and not to buy those cheap machine now 6, Choose a good future crypto currency There are many coins in this field now, we need to analyse and find a better direction for mining. Like Z11, many people use it for ZEN mining nowadays, and their benefits is top now. Also, people buy many S17, it can earn money back before next year half reward time. And they believe the BTC price will increase creazily as last two times. 7, Make plan for your selling of coin or machine As you know, the price of the BTC changes everytime, we can mining the BTC first and keep it in hand, do not sell it every day. It is very stupid. Just sell it when price high, you do not need to take any risk if you do not buy BTC directy. We do not need to care about the low price situation, we only need to wait. When chance come, get it. Same for machine 8. Don't be fooled by the mining calculator Many sites calculate mining profits based on hardware and electricity prices. If you've never mined before, you might be happy to see the numbers provided by these websites and calculators and think, "I'll make a fortune!" However, these websites don't tell you: in addition to the cost of electricity, there may be other current costs, such as maintenance, cooling, rent, labor, etc. Generally, the hash rate and power consumption of the device are slightly different from what the factory says. This difference is more common in unpopular brands. You can better understand the actual hash rate and the actual power consumption by watching the miner test video on YouTube. In addition, depending on the distance from the meter to the device and the type of cable used, the power loss from the meter to the device can be as high as 200 watts. In addition to the cost of mining machines, some initial costs are required to prepare the infrastructure, such as cooling and venting, cabling and distribution, shelves, network and monitoring equipment, safety measures, etc. The network difficulty is constantly changing and increasing at a significant speed, which directly affects the mining revenue. You can check the bitcoin network difficulty chart to see its growth rate, but your miner will not always be 100% active. Due to maintenance, network problems, ore pool problems, power problems and many other problems, the miner may be offline for several hours. I suggest that you consider setting the normal operation time of the miner to less than 97% when calculating. We have rich mining experience in professional ore pools, and the normal operation time of these mining machines will not exceed 97-98%. Thats all, hope those information will help you become a good mining investor.
Litecoin Difficulty Calculators are misleading. The proper approach to difficulty increases and new hardware ROI calculations.
Going through thread after thread I am consistently seeing a common misconception. The proper way to look at mining rig ROI rates is brought up in various places, but it is clearly being ignored en mass (i.e. the nooblets out there swarming in on our society). Calculators like these below are simple calculations based on the current difficulty. http://www.litecoinminingcalculator.com/http://www.coinwarz.com/calculators/litecoin-mining-calculatorhttps://www.litecoinpool.org/calc These provide a number of outputs revenue rates over different time scales.. Hr, Day, Month..year.. Which makes them very very misleading. Let's walk through a couple scenarios and asses the current situation of the network, what difficulty rate increases are 'possible' and how hardware availability has an effect. Example Scenario If I were to pick up a Radeon 280x and get it hasing at ~700Kh (let's assume free electricity for the examples). One of these calculators would output the following: 0.36 LTC / Day 10.75 LTC / Month 130.88 LTC / Year Often times you see someone buying some new mining equip saying - oh s*&^ I can drop $300 on a new card and earn 10.75 LTC in a month. Leading to the assumption the hardware will pay itself off in just 1 month's time. However - reality quickly hits once you look at the network difficulty increases. The Litecoin network normalizes the difficulty every 2016 blocks such that the next 2016 blocks will have an estimated solution time of 3.5 days. Thus the difficulty will increase or decrease based on the network hashrate roughly ever 3.4-3.6 days (you should all know this - if you don't - read up https://litecoin.info/Main_Page). Past difficulty increases have been between -14.82% and 20% with the last two increases being >13% - the largest 7 day increase in difficulty ever (source: http://bitcoinwisdom.com/litecoin/difficulty - bottom of the page). With the recent increase in LTC/USD and LTC/BTC prices - GPUs have been flying off the shelves and it is a generally accepted assumption that we will see a large network hashrate increase in the near future. If we see similar ~10% difficulty increases every 3.5 days - we will be at a difficulty of 4600 in 1 month and 312000 in 2 months. The propagation of a 700Kh miner output is shown in the table here from my own calculator. STABLE DIFFICULTY INCREASE SPEED 700 KH/s LTC/USD 40 $ DIFFICULTY JUMP/2016 Blocks 10% Time between Diff Jumps 3.5
The above examples assume a steady difficulty increase from now until forever - which as the past would suggest - is unlikely (LTC diff historically jumps all over the place with many near zero changes and some large positive/negative changes. The average diff change in the past 6 months is ~+2.3%). There are only so many GPUs being manufactured, only so many miners mining LTC over another crypto at any one time and there is of course downtime for hardware issues. To assume there will be a 15% increase from now until the end of February every 3.5 days resulting in a difficulty 32X what it is now which may not sound unreasonable (65,000) - but in my opinion unlikely. Lets take a look at some numbers.. If The network hashrate reflecst the influx of new GPUs - it is therefore related to the number of GPUs produced and sold / unit time. If there have been 100,000 GPUs sold and put online in the next month with an average hash rate of 500Kh/s running 24/7 the hashrate would roughly double. (increase by 50,000 GH/s) 1 million GPUs added to the network would increase the hashrate by roughly 500MH/s or 10x what it currently is now - bringing the difficulty to approximately 20,000. This still does not reach the 15% increase rate of 65,000 by the end of February - so you must ask yourself.. is a skyrocketing difficulty based on added recent interest reasonable? From the 3rd example where the network hashrate increases in the short term and levels off in the long term - We only need to see an influx of 4-5X the current network hashrate before the end of December to increase the difficulty enough such that in the long term ROI may not be possible. This is the equivalent of ~400k GPUs. So I employ you to ask yourself a few of the following questions
What is a realistic number of GPUs to enter the network in the next month? Iin the next ~2-6 months?
So far LTC has avoided the ASIC craze - but there are mfg's out there claiming future products - how will this change the shape of LTC - will it be similar to BTC where GPU mining went obsolete in a matter of a month, or will it be a slower race?
Just a bit of food for thought. Realistically calculate your ROI and proceed under the impression there are many new miners hopping on this bandwagon in the near term. Take comments that say "Diff is going to go through the rooooooof" skeptically and ask yourself what lies within 'reason'. This all of course assumes a stable price at or near $40/LTC which is subject to great fluctuations. However, IMO the real way to judge a miner's ROI is by the # of coins it produces vs. the intiail cost of the hardware in coins at purchase. I.e. Cheers. EDIT 1: Two good calculator alternatives.
EDIT 2: Let's take a look at mining pools shall we? At the time of posting per: https://www.litecoinpool.org/pools - the top 3 pools contain roughly 60% of the network hashrate. If you visit their pages we can deduce a bit of information about how many people are mining and rough orders hashrate magnitude. http://wemineltc.com/statshttps://coinotron.com/coinotron/AccountServlet?action=statistics At wemineltc there are ~26000 workers outputting a total HR of 14.7 GH. At Coinotron the number of miners is not disclosed, however the top 20 miners account for 16% of the total pool HR. At LiteGardian there are 5118 miners outting a total HR of 9.2 GH. So making a few assumptions - there are roughly 50-60k workers on the top 3 pools with ~60% of the network hashrate and 5-6% of that hashrate comes from only 20 miners. To continue, If there are 50,000 workers (rounding down) outputting ~50GH (rounding way up) - this is an average HR of 1MH/worker. (Still talking about the top 60% of the HR in the top 3 pools). But we know that ~2GH comes from 20 miners - and there are many people mining with rigs <2 top end GPUs - mining is certainly a 'top heavy' economy. Now you must ask - how many workers does each miner run.. etc. I estimate that this approximate 50k workers equates to less than 25k individual miners. So ~25k miners have constitute the top 60% of the network hashrate and have an average of ~2Mh each. How many people are LTC mining on dedicated rigs? Part time on gaming rigs? To me, looking at a number of ~1,000,000 people mining LTC at this time is far fetched and lies somewhere in the lower order of magnitude.. maybe 50-100k people on the entire network. Back to my previous examples.. how many GPUs must sell and come online to increase the hashrate.. and how many new miners? If every miner gets 1 new GPU hashing at 500KH and the number of miners triples and new miners have an average of 4 500KH GPUs... 25k * 500KH + 25k * 2000KH + 60GH (current rate) = 172GH network rate. (This would be ~300,000 new 500KH GPUs on the network) I can see the network hashrate increasing 2-5 times in the near future (2-4 months), but without the advent of a new technology that increases hashrates significantly I believe the limiting factor will be two fold. New miners and quantity of available new GPUs. Edit 3. New analysis here: http://www.reddit.com/litecoinmining/comments/1s88ka/ltc_difficulty_predictions_an_alternative_method/
We are back! For the last 2 years there was not much to shill in mining mining was on the life support. And the profits constantly got decreasing. Start of 2020 Bitcoin and Altcoins are showing great performance in price action. This price action has also increased mining profits in some coins for more then 100% since december 2019. It might be to early to say that “we are back” , as crypto can be so unpredictable. But there is a lot of signs that we have now oversold a lot and value of crypto market is increasing steadily. We might see this pattern continue for good bit of times as BTC halving is coming up in 3 month. Let’s get in straight in. I will choose 3 hardware devices which in my opinion would be the best choice and we will see how profitable they are. If you are new to mining and you want to know which devices to choose, choose from top market cap coins latest equipment. This will be your safest bet, as the mining profits are much more stable on bigger cap coins then on smaller cap coins. If you are small miner and don’t have large electric bills, you can choose smaller cap coins. They might go up in price lot faster then bigger cap coins in bull market, but be aware they they might dump lot faster. It is high risk high reward type of mining. If you are really serious about mining, you need to look at cheapest power source possible which would be in 0.05c a kw/h range. It is not 2017 and mining from home wont be profitable at 0.30c a kw/h. Industrial power is possible to achieve 0.05 in many places in the world. If it is not possible in your country , look for the country where it is possible. So all profit calculations done for 0.05c a kw/h Top mining profitability websites :
https://www.asicminervalue.com/ It is great website to see newest ASIC miners and their profitability. Usually the new upcoming mining machines gets listed here. So come and checkout this page every few days/weeks this page if you are serious about mining.
https://whattomine.com/ Is the best known for GPU/CPU mining profitability. You can choose what ever hardware to use and it will give you the best and most profitable coins to mine. It is very simple to use it. It does have Also asic miner profitability check, but for asics i do prefer asicminervalue,com
Bitcoin – Most suitable Antminer S17+ . It is one of the efficient Bitcoin miner currently publicly available, alternatives would be M20s miner and Avalon miner 1166. Antminer S17 efficiency is 73TH/s @ 3000watts . Current profitability after you have paid your electric bill is 7.82 usd in 24hours , with ROI achievable in 6-7month. It does seems great, but crypto doesn’t stand still. And has plenty of risks.
Ethereum – Best miner to use is RX5700 graphic cards mining rig. I know there is an ASIC miner available A10, but most of you who are in mining will agree with me, that it is complete junk. It is only slightly more efficient then RX5700 gpu rig in terms of price per hash and watt per hash . But it is 10x more riskier investment in mining rig then buying GPU mining rig. So the efficiency of 12xgpu RX5700 mining rig is 640 mh/s @ 1700watts. Current profitability after you have paid your electric bill is 7.62 usd in 24hours , with ROI achievable in about 20-22 month. Ethereum is one of the underdogs which could perform quite well in 2020 and might reduce your ROI much more faster.
DASH – Lately has been released most efficient DASH miner STU-U6. Asic miners are very risky investment, but sometimes they might be very profitable. The beauty of this miner is that it is quite new model and it is mining profitably DASH , even that DASH is still over 90%down from its all time highs. This miner performance is 420GH/s u/2100 watts. Current profitability after you have paid your electric bill is 8.11 usd in 24hours , with ROI achievable in about 5-6 month.
I used NH profit calculator and the profit is almost the same.is that calculator accurate? And I know that 1080ti is not very good for ETH like 1070 but after all ETH will convert to POS.so for the long term what do suggest for building a new rig? Thanks
Do you guys consider buying an antminer s9 at around 700$ a good idea if electricity is free?
We all know it's very likely that a new antminer is coming but even then do you guys consider an s9 a good investment if you had free electricity (It's not free but very very cheap in my country) considering that if a new one is introduced it will not be cheap and/or easily available?
I mined a few bitcoins back in the day before GPUs and ASICs were a thing, but I haven't thought about mining until this week when I read about Monero and the RandomX hard fork. I know crypto mining on consumer hardware isn't going to make anyone rich, but I ran some calculations to see if I could offset some costs of my current setup with mining. Since I'm new to Monero I thought I'd run this by more experienced miners to make sure I'm not way off base. I have a pretty basic Ryzen 5 3600 (ASRock B450M, Corsair LPX 3000MHz CL15) setup for my homelab (virtualization, storage, Plex, etc). Most of the time the CPU usage is under 10% with occasional spikes for Plex transcoding or if I'm testing something in my virtual lab. Idle power usage at the UPS is about 80W, under full CPU load it spikes to 120-140W. My thought here is that only the difference in power usage (40-60W) should count toward the mining calculations since the server will be running 24/7 whether I'm mining or not. Based on some conservative numbers of 5kH/s and 60W at $0.10/KWh (and assuming constant price and difficulty, not accurate I know) it looks like I could make about $6/month or $50/year. If I calculate with the full 140W it comes out to a few dollars per year, so theoretically mining with spare CPU could cover my server operating costs. Any pitfalls or gotchas I'm not considering here? I already own the hardware so I'm not looking for ROI there, just wondering if it's possible to recoup operating costs in USD by mining Monero.
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